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Research participation opportunity

Simon

Ruthy
I love that you tagged this 🙂
Are you in discussion with Katie Allen?

Have you joined there community at https://apdp.sixcircles.co/?

Katie invited me to
I’m more interested in talking about its management than I feel is appropriate to posting threads on it
🙂

Scrub that I just signed up and it’s mainly people with a academic credentials - from the look of it it’s not very active - That gives the opportunity to be noticed

Let’s try @nige?

Caio
Simon

Nige

Yes I am on there.
Perhaps I will pose a question

Nige

I get the feeling I might need to use long words and some words I don’t instantly know the meaning of to seem credible on that forum.
I suspect using the word pain in central post stroke pain will be frowned upon.

Simon

Nige
I think we’ve a knowledge they can’t get near to having.

And I think you’ve awareness of their world that will give any a run for their money

🙂
3¢

Nige

Simon we might have find a forum for Dr Simon, Dr Ruth and Dr Nige that’s nice and active ?
Operation Bluff??

Simon

Nige
I used to think those with a PhD must be very learned.

Now I realise many PhDs count for nothing at all.

We don’t need to play the game of external credential granted us by some organisation with self-interest over integrity.

We have the knowledge in a visceral sense that that can direct questions and evaluate responses as to their usefulness - that’s what the higher education process is supposed to do.

It clearly isn’t

Andrew

Simon
“I used to think those with a PhD must be very learned.” Yes, and I thought that those with a university post must also be learned. Possibly revered. But my attitudes have changed. As Groucho Marx once said (and this is only roughly remembered), “I won’t belong to a group that would have me as a member”.

“Now I realise many PhDs count for nothing at all.” Also agreed. A test is: how long is it for the PhD recipient to begin to think that the thesis content is useless!

“We don’t need to play the game of external credential granted us by some organisation with self-interest over integrity.” Definitely agreed with too. But within academia these days promotion is secured by how much money can be brought in, rather than by the quality of the person. It wasn’t always like this….. I have often thought of Andrew Wiles as an exemplar.

“We have the knowledge in a visceral sense that that can direct questions and evaluate responses as to their usefulness - that’s what the higher education process is supposed to do.” Also true. However, it is very important to use the language which academics understand and are used to expressing themselves in. Some papers are indeed very obscure, but clarity of thought and the consequent ease of understanding helps enormously. It also assists others not to have that knee-jerk reaction which consigns us immediately to the loony bin without looking at the content. Academics are people too, and are also prone to those reactions.

I’ll just say that academics are no longer old-school. They now have an enormous number of administrative stuff to do, feedback to 300+ students, committees to sit on, and all before spending months on a grant application which has less than a 20% chance of success. Then there is the teaching to large classes. And finally we’re supposed to collaborate internationally, go to overseas conferences (sounds good, but the pressure to find collaborators is there), and produce at least two internationally-leading papers per year. Where in all of that do they have the time to sit and think? It’s a luxury too far. And no jokes about “what do you do over the long holidays?” Life is now far worse than being a conscientious teacher.

Rant over………for now. But I do fear for my ex-colleagues and their propensity for getting a stroke due to the extreme pressures. This is why I fiercely guard my stress levels and my BP.

Simon

Andrew

I recognise and concur with all your points bar one.

I do not agree

Andrew important to use the language which academics understand and are used to expressing themselves in

If we model the world as an onion then the truist level of academic - professors and research fellows in the middle can use that language as their lingua franca.
Their students, the PhD candidates need to be versed in this language and able to usefully apply their knowledge in the real world. We the furthest from the centre should be deriving value expressed and delivered using our language.

This is also something the education process has not grasped the importance of
It requires being ambidextrous (sic - well perhaps the phrases ‘a chameleon’)

The point of education outside of academia is to equip people to operate with value in the real world.
I have a bee in the bonnet about third party credentializing organisations like the Project Management Institute and the Agile Industrial Complex who have completely destroyed the system of post nominals - The declaration of some knowledge as wrong because it is not included in an institution’s own published body of knowledge is scandalous - we are lurching off topic 🙂

The people on here comprise a spectrum of insights which combined have the required wisdom to evaluate, improve & the design the delivery of life after stroke services (and stroke avoidance)

The change of demographic and the fundamental shift that digital communications introduce are all in a melting pot.

Those we could look to for leadership and facilitation and connection and orchestration and prioritisation and… have rejected our overtures [and rejected them in a personalised and vindictive way - Thats unfortunate because it introduces unhelpful and totally avoidable emotional dimensions 🙁 ]

So we need to find more depth and breadth to our advocacy.
What we don’t need is to pretend qualification when we have the genuine thing ‘knowledge’

Thanks for giving the spur too work out these thoughts - If only I could remember and verbalize them when it mattered !! 🙁

Caio
Simon

Andrew

I am not sure that I understand what you have posted. It needs a fair bit of unpacking. It’s too high-faluting for me, and I am not sure that I can see what is being attacked! I now realise (after looking it up) that I have a post-nominal! I certainly don’t agree that we are the furthest from the centre if we are using an onion (most nutrition at the centre) as a picture. And most institutions look at when and where in addition to the face-value of most qualifications in order to estimate ‘worth’ or ‘usefulness’.

The following is an unpacking/illustration of what I meant.

One of the things I have always said to my new first years is that the manner in which they write to (i) their grandmother, (ii) their nearest and dearest, (iii) a job application, (iv) a report/thesis are all different. Each has own jargon and manner of expression. In each case the language is different, and different norms are applied. It would be terrible to write to your nearest and dearest in the same way as to your grandmother, or the other way around! So terminology is important, and we need to know what to use.

For us stroke-survivors, we talk to each other in certain ways - we’ve all been through the wringer and are trying to emerge as unscathed as possible. But we would talk differently to the press, or for that two-minute slot on the local TV news, to engage with academics, to engage with social services etc. We have to learn the lingo for each case.

At work we have had cross-disciplinary research. The first thing that happens has got to be a lengthy discussion about terminology. A mathematician and a financier will have to talk about the fractal diffusion of resources, for example. It’s called different things in the different disciplines. How does fractal diffusion arise, for instance? There’s a long adjustment period for the participants.

For those in academia or in rehab (not the patients!) who have had extensive experience, there is little to do for they understand each other. It may well be a different matter when the experience is next to nothing. This too has to be established in our external dealings. Discussion of this type happens all the time in the Social Sciences because there are many strands involved.

Note that I have not made any value judgements here. Neither party is better than the other, but they must have some common ground in order to discuss anything.

Andrew

Simon

Andrew too high-faluting

Oh !

Andrew attacked!

Wouldn’t have been my choice of word

Andrew most institutions

Agreed but that doesn’t mean that’s the way the whole marketplace then operates because there are memetics that make a drive for the bottom a trend that is hard to buck.

Andrew terminology is important

Agreed - and in general the service supplier must understand how to communicate on a par with the norms for the service recipient. In some professions/ settings it’s used as an obfuscation. Great When it promotes the esoteric bonding of a peer group. A digression but that is apparently the role that swear words used as punctuation are suggested by some linguists to now serve in professional circles! 😉

Andrew happens has got to be a lengthy discussion about terminology

Yes. I use I used to go into organisations as a consultant. I was known as the idiot in some places because I asked for every abbreviation to be expanded, every item of jargon to be explained. Not because I didn’t know what they meant but because I knew that those around the table had different expansions and definitions and clear communication is the first step for unmasking disagreements and causes for (apparent) non-cooperation

Andrew Neither party is better than the other, but

Precisely the starting point for analysis. Mine above was intended as a description of the drivers creating a lamentable situation that bears examination and correction…

Caio
Simon

Andrew

An additional email….

I have decided to attend the following webinar on April 1st. It is a combination of my research expertise (porous materials and their effect on transport) and strokes (a recent interest!)

https://www.interpore.org/product/64

My suspicion in advance is that we won’t get much of a take-away from this, but I shall attend anyway and report back if there is anything that I deem to be of interest. This is primarily about microstrokes and ischemic strokes, and because mine was haemorrhagic it is very unlikely that I will get any benefit from it. However, despite being German, her Abstract is very clearly written in English. This is quite standard for academics in the West.

Andrew

Ruthy

It’s kinda funny, my ischaemic stroke was on 1st April (my sisters birthday too) 😆

Simon

Ruthy
Still not laughing matter though 🙁
🤗

Ruthy

Simon funny/peculiar/coincidental

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